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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 27, 2014 19:42:21 GMT -5
I'm fired??! Thank goodness. That above statement is coming from THE expert in fire!!! Ouch. Sorry, won't go there any more. I heard the news waaaay down here. He's not ... Haines Law ! Very few people get a free pass in my life , Sir Schimmster is one. , Bo Turocy is two . His Heart is always in the right place ... Just Trust me on this , or read his why story ! Nobody is an expert on anything , that is why these Jeep forums even exist .... Say it one more time!!! Not about the vehicle , about the People!!! |
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 27, 2014 19:43:08 GMT -5
There you have it !
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Post by Deleted on Aug 27, 2014 20:18:51 GMT -5
If #1 has no compression, you might have found your head gasket leak. fill up the radiator so you can see the coolant, start engine. Look for bubbles. No bubbles? Stop engine, change oil. Who knows what happened in the 3 years it sat. It was wet enough to seize up the engine at least a little. That last jeep trip 3 years ago could have been through the deep part of "CJ canyon" and water has been in the engine since. You didn't see it because it separated out while sitting 3 years and collected at the bottom of the pan below the reach of the dipstick. Rudy...I bolted the oil pan back in place and refilled her with 5 fresh quarts of glistening tan oil. Pulled out the PCV valve and cleaned that crusty thing up and then reattached it. And that's about where my courage bottomed out. I closed the garage door, turned out the light and turned my back on this stressful project...for the night.  Everything seemed so perfect for the moment, so I thought I wouldn't ruin it. Maybe tomorrow I'll start it. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 7:31:11 GMT -5
So.....I flipped the key and hit the starter today. Man, she comes to life, fast! But I found out what Rudy predicted: bubbles in the radiator coolant. I let her run for about 5 or so minutes in the driveway. The new oil still looked clean. Or would I need to run it longer to make a milkshake? I'm thinking the coolant isn't going in, yet, since exhaust gases are going out, right?  So it is either head gasket or crack, right? I guess it could be a warped head, too, maybe. However, he said some time ago he removed the thermostat because it wasn't working (probably like what lee mentioned earlier). He has had a lot of coolant issues...always getting hot and pouring out the overflow tube. So odds are, it isn't so much the head gasket. Like what HG told me (the only smart thing ever to come out of his mouth) is that something caused the original gasket to fail between 2 and 3. What are your cyber thoughts, guys? |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 7:53:29 GMT -5
PS...the exhaust was clear. Not white. Not blue. Invisible.
And thanks Oily for the heads up where the leak would be if the coolant got past the head bolt threads. Yay me! Only coolant escaping is thru the overflow tube or when I had the cap off.
I've got a short video of it, but HG's crappy forum won't let me upload it from my phone like I can the pictures. At idle, the bubbles aren't bad...but they get pretty violent when the accelerator gets pushed.
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Post by rudycon on Aug 28, 2014 9:33:13 GMT -5
Well bummer Moose. I'm glad you were able to sleep well for one night there. I've never had one of those engines, so use the experts before you listen to some hack in Colorado well out of choking range. This is an L head. There isn't any oil up in the head gasket. Just water and combustion chamber gasses, right? No oil in the water, just gasses, so I don't think the block is cracked. So if you fix the head gasket leak, that will fix the no compression on 1 problem and the exhaust in the coolant. We still really don't know how the water got mixed with the oil. I suppose it could get into the cylinder while the engine cools down, then sneak down past the rings into the oil pan, but I think the engine would have been locked up even tighter if that were the case and there would be steamy startups. I suppose if this was a long term problem...and she never got hot enough to boil off the water in the engine...water could build up in the oil. What would I do? retorque the head bolts. retest compression on #1. You have nothin' to loose. (Plus, the right wrench will already be out on the fender for the next step.) Fix the head gasket (probably going to have to have the head milled) and check block for straightness too. Get a good head gasket seal and you could fix 3 things at once. compression on #1. No more air in the coolant, no more coolant in the oil. Sorry Mooseman. Back into the engine. Hey, but it is honest work eh? I hope the real pros have a better plan than I do. (I'm waiting for Hillbilly to tell you to just pull the motor and start over with a total engine rebuild.  ) Wanna feel better? Lemme tell ya what's wrong with the Studebaker: Overheats = radiator too small, ineffective shroud, fan too far from core. Rusty goo collects on bottom of radiator cap = engine block probably full of rust. fuel boils from the fuel pump to the carb = need to come up with a better fuel pumping/plumbing solution. Never pulled the oil pan. I have no oil filter or PCV system. I have a feeling the pan is full of sludge. Oil pressure drops to "Disconcerting" when engine is hot. I'll have to do something when it gets down to "disparaging." Never adjusted the valves. I can't even see the tappet cover bolts, let alone adjust the valves. I might have to pull the intake/exhaust to get in there. Rube goldberg throttle linkage. Wanna feel even better? When I bought the Stude-a-willys, the freeze plugs were popped out! |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 11:57:36 GMT -5
bubbles in the water could be as simple as when you pulled the head you trapped air in it and it is still working itself out. it takes a while, my friends diesel is still bleeding out air and it had the head off a month ago. yes it is air from removing the head.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 12:14:47 GMT -5
Who needs drugs when you can have all the crack you'll ever want with a Jeep engine! Since you are seeing bubbles and it's blowing the antifreeze out, you are back to another bad head gasket or cracked head or block. They like to crack in the middle of the block first out into the two studs, Then they crack from a water jacket holes over and into a valve pocket. The head cracks where ever it wants to. They also crack at the valve seat. All lets compression leak into the water cavity and pressure the radiator and then spit it out. If your engine doesn't have the bypass hose to the water pump, then you need the bypass hole in the thermostat. Otherwise when the engine heats up and is supposed to open the thermostat, there is a air pocket right around the thermostat which doesn't allow the water to contact the thermostat. It doesn't open until the block is very hot. Then when it does, it "shocks" the system and blows out a good gallon of fluid. Now you are low and it gets hot anyway. Stupid bad simple. If you pull the head, clean off the deck of carbon and spray some brake clean on it. Then take a rag and dry off the deck and quickley look for cracks that appear as a wet line in the metal. You might possibly see the wet line also from antifreeze . If you have a real good straight edge, lay it on the surface and shine a light under it. If you are warped you'll see too much light and then none. Or you can use a feeler gauge and test for clearance. You don't want over .004. Best method is manafluxing it. The machine shop passes a curret through the block or head and sprays a dust that will collect along the cracks where the current is broken. They also can do a pressure test where they actually block the valve pockets and pressure up the water jacket and look for seepage. You can also have internal cracks. A jeep is known to crack the bore that the distributor passes through. Look in there also. It can be fixed with a piece of 5/8 copper tubing and some permatex and driving the tube into the hole. The distributor will still work through the copper tube. If the crack is not in a bad place, you can v it and seal it with JB weld. It's got to be very clean. Oilly
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 28, 2014 14:58:53 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 28, 2014 17:22:35 GMT -5
Hallelujah!! Jedi Master Mechanic Haines comes to the rescue! It is obviously my Quad 4 that is all gunked up and causing thus trouble. What a simple fix! All you others that tried to help me with my coolant issues, well bless your dear hearts (said with an overdone Scarlet OHara accent). You tried to help and I appreciate that, but you all best go back along to your shady tree and continue wrenching on your non running automobiles that are perched high atop a stack of cinder blocks.
Haines Garage has seen through the chocalaty milkshake wasters and has...well, wasted 5 minutes of my life watching that video! Maybe I'm dumber than the box of chocolates that I am currently eating, but WTF was in that video that we already didn't know?
And bring back my goat!
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 28, 2014 17:33:58 GMT -5
I knew that would get you !!
Just can't let a sleeping dog lie!
Nor can I stop beating your sorry butt up !!
I am really starting to enjoy it!
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 28, 2014 17:54:23 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 11:25:55 GMT -5
Any updates?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 11:32:13 GMT -5
Nope...no updates.  Jeep is untouched and HG still has the goat. I was just sitting here and thinking if there were any other tests that could be performed...vacuum, compression...before popping the head off in order to narrow things down. I'm afraid what a vacuum gauge might say since there might be multiple things wrong. |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 11:51:05 GMT -5
Just did a wet compression test on #1. It read 15 lbs. that was easy enough.
...now it's time to go back to work.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 13:00:51 GMT -5
Wow. I can't find this anywhere on the charts! Haha!
There are some leaks....the carb is mostly closed to run at idle.
I let the engine run up to temperature with my good radiator cap in place. Shut it off and pulled the spark plugs. After sitting for 10 min, with ignition off, I turned the starter over a few times looking for coolant to spew from the holes. Nothing came out.
When I had the rad cap off, there were no bubbles in the beginning. It did burn a little oil, but I figured that was from #1 cylinder and the wet compression test. Eventually the rad bubbled again when depressing the accelerator.
If I do anything next, it will probably be to pull the dizzy and look inside the shaft for coolant.
By the way, the oil is still clean!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 14:29:29 GMT -5
If your getting bubbles under acceleration its most likely the head gasket, the distributor bore will not do this. I still think you got the coolant from the head removal. Pull the head again and see if the head needs surfacing or the deck of the block does, and why is there one dead hole, fix that as well. Also quit using those $hit head gaskets and get a copper one from MWM or Walcks...................And drain the f'ing oil before you remove the head this time  . Lee  |
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 29, 2014 14:38:14 GMT -5
He Told You!!!!!!!
Hahahahaha!
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Post by Moose on Aug 29, 2014 16:36:41 GMT -5
Captain Crunch...
The major hole in your hypothesis is the coolant from the head draining into the oil. You must have missed the part in the beginning where the inside of the head had tumbleweed blowing through because it was sooooo dry.
There is always a chance that I botched the gasket installation, but I don't think Ron Fitzpatrick sold me a shit gasket.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 16:56:33 GMT -5
Captain Crunch... The major hole in your hypothesis is the coolant from the head draining into the oil. You must have missed the part in the beginning where the inside of the head had tumbleweed blowing through because it was sooooo dry. There is always a chance that I botched the gasket installation, but I don't think Ron Fitzpatrick sold me a shit gasket. MOOSESTEER !! LISTEN TO LEE !!!!
QUIT PISSING AROUND AND DO WHAT YOU NEED TO DO THE RIGHT WAY THE FIRST TIME..HE WONT STEER YOU IN THE WRONG DIRECTION , NEITHER WILL A COUPLE OF THE OTHER OLD FARTS THAT HAVE DONE THIS STUFF BEFORE MORE THAN ONCE..UNLESS YOU JUST LIKE GETTING YOUR ASS SPANKED ALL THE TIME  ..COPPER GASKETS ARE THE WAY TO GO NOT THE REPRODUCTION SHITZ -NICK THATS OUT THERE....BELIEVE ME THERE ARE BETTER MATERIAL THAN OMIX-ADA OUT THERE THAT EVEN ADVANCE -OREILLYS-CARQUEST SELLS FOR GASKETS..I JUST BOUGHT 6 OIL SEALS FOR THE INTAKE VALVES TODAY AT ADVANCE --MADE IN THE USA |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 18:18:45 GMT -5
Captain Crunch... The major hole in your hypothesis is the coolant from the head draining into the oil. You must have missed the part in the beginning where the inside of the head had tumbleweed blowing through because it was sooooo dry. There is always a chance that I botched the gasket installation, but I don't think Ron Fitzpatrick sold me a shit gasket. No my friend, "YOU" missed the part about draining the oil. The old $hitty oil that was in the pan from the last guy!. The last head gasket was f'd and the missing coolant was in the pan with the old $hitty oil, actually underneath the old $hitty oil. After your "Presidential Upgrade" you took it out for a spin and stirred the $hit up. So here is what you need to do! 1) remove the head, check head and deck of the block for warpage. I would bet your head needs resufacing  2) The cyl. with no compression is not going to heal it'self. Is it a valve that needs lapping, or rings )?(, figure that out and fix it!  3) Put it back together "WITH" a "COPPER" head gasket, a new T stat/with hole drilled in to vent air from cyl head. Then climb in and go for a ride as it "WILL" work now. Lee |
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 29, 2014 20:04:55 GMT -5
Captain Crunch... The major hole in your hypothesis is the coolant from the head draining into the oil. You must have missed the part in the beginning where the inside of the head had tumbleweed blowing through because it was sooooo dry. There is always a chance that I botched the gasket installation, but I don't think Ron Fitzpatrick sold me a shit gasket. No my friend, "YOU" missed the part about draining the oil. The old $hitty oil that was in the pan from the last guy!. The last head gasket was f'd and the missing coolant was in the pan with the old $hitty oil, actually underneath the old $hitty oil. After your "Presidential Upgrade" you took it out for a spin and stirred the $hit up. So here is what you need to do! 1) remove the head, check head and deck of the block for warpage. I would bet your head needs resufacing 2) The cyl. with no compression is not going to heal it'self. Is it a valve that needs lapping, or rings )?(, figure that out and fix it! 3) Put it back together "WITH" a "COPPER" head gasket, a new T stat/with hole drilled in to vent air from cyl head. Then climb in and go for a ride as it "WILL" work now. Lee Told you twice! |
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Post by Haines Garage on Aug 29, 2014 20:05:36 GMT -5
And I still got the goat!!!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 20:11:43 GMT -5
And I still got the goat!!! Be careful around that goat Haines, if it came from Tallboots it's most likely stump broke . Lee |
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Post by Deleted on Aug 29, 2014 21:07:15 GMT -5
And I still got the goat!!! Maybe not.........heard the Mt. Pleasant sex-ed class was looking for one..... |
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..COPPER GASKETS ARE THE WAY TO GO NOT THE REPRODUCTION SHITZ -NICK THATS OUT THERE....BELIEVE ME THERE ARE BETTER MATERIAL THAN OMIX-ADA OUT THERE THAT EVEN ADVANCE -OREILLYS-CARQUEST SELLS FOR GASKETS..I JUST BOUGHT 6 OIL SEALS FOR THE INTAKE VALVES TODAY AT ADVANCE --MADE IN THE USA 
